INFO needed urgently

[chicken_feet]

Send a MM to airport when her extended visa expired, but she was arrested as the visa was forged. She was held at ica. She called me to say that she was being charged for 2 offences the next day => cheating and overstay for more than 50+ days as she had extended twice for a month each.

The MF agent that did her visa even plead with her not to expose him and she really listen to him.:mad:

From the day she was charged till now there was no more news from her, I guess she was jailed liao.

So post this thread to ask bros here anyone encounter the same thing before for their MM? How long will she be jailed? Will she be able to come to Sg again?

Thanks in advance:)

[Cheri_Popper]

she was arrested as the visa was forged. She was held at ica. She called me to say that she was being charged for 2 offences the next day => cheating and overstay for more than 50+ days as she had extended twice for a month each.

From the day she was charged till now there was no more news from her, I guess she was jailed liao.

So post this thread to ask bros here anyone encounter the same thing before for their MM? How long will she be jailed? Will she be able to come to Sg again?

Thanks in advance:)

Firstly it is forgery with the intention to cheat. I doubt she will be charge for this as she is the victim in this case.

Secondly, she is an overstayer and her visa had expired and her status would be that of an Illegal Immigrant.

Removal of illegal immigrants Sec 32 cap 133 Immigration Act
(1) Any person who is convicted of an offence under section 5, 6, 8 or 9 shall be liable to be removed from Singapore by order of the Controller.

(2) No citizen of Singapore convicted of an offence under section 5 shall be ordered to be removed from Singapore under this section.

Removal of persons unlawfully remaining in Singapore Sec 33 Immigration Act
1) Where the presence of any person in Singapore is unlawful by reason of section 15 or 62, that person shall, whether or not any proceedings are taken against him in respect of any offence under that section, be liable to be removed from Singapore by order of the Controller.

(2) Any person in respect of whom an order of removal has been made under subsection (1) may appeal to the Minister in such manner and within such time as may be prescribed.

(3) There shall be no appeal under subsection (2) against an order of removal under subsection (1) made in respect of any person whose presence in Singapore is unlawful under section 15 or 62 by reason of the expiry of any pass relating to or issued to him.

(4) An appeal under subsection (2) shall not operate as a stay of execution of any order of removal under subsection (1).

(5) Where an order of removal under subsection (1) has been made in respect of any person, any permit, certificate or pass to enter or remain in Singapore issued to him under this Act or the regulations shall cease to be valid.

(6) Nothing in this Part or the regulations shall require the Minister, the Controller or any other public officer to disclose any fact, produce any document or assign any reason for the making of any removal order under this Part which he considers it to be against the public interest to do so.

Detention of persons ordered to be removed Sec 34 Cap 133 Immigration Act
(1) Where any person is ordered to be removed from Singapore under the provisions of this Act, it shall be lawful for the Controller to order that person to be detained in custody for such period as may be necessary for the purpose of making arrangements for his removal.

(2) Any person detained under subsection (1) who appeals under section 33 (2) against the order of removal may, in the discretion of the Controller, be released, pending the determination of his appeal, on such conditions as to furnishing security or otherwise as the Controller may think fit.

(3) Subject to the determination of any appeal under section 33, any person who is ordered to be removed from Singapore may be placed on board a suitable vessel, aircraft or train by any police officer or immigration officer, and may be lawfully detained on board that vessel, aircraft or train, so long as the vessel, aircraft or train is within the limits of Singapore.

(4) Any person who is detained in custody in pursuance of an order made by the Controller under subsection (1) may be so detained in any prison, police station or immigration depot, or in any other place appointed for the purpose by the Controller.

Unlawful return after removal Sec 36 Cap 133 Immigration Act
Any person who, having been removed or otherwise lawfully sent out of Singapore, enters or resides in Singapore without the permission in writing of the Controller shall be guilty of an offence and shall on conviction be punished with imprisonment for a term of not less than one year and not more than 3 years and shall also be liable to a fine not exceeding $6,000, and shall in addition be liable to be removed from Singapore.

[chicken_feet]

Detention of persons ordered to be removed Sec 34 Cap 133 Immigration Act

(4) Any person who is detained in custody in pursuance of an order made by the Controller under subsection (1) may be so detained in any prison, police station or immigration depot, or in any other place appointed for the purpose by the Controller.


Bro CP,
if she is really charged under this act, any chance to find out where she is held and for how long before being send back to China?:confused:

[speedmiester]

wah bro Cheri_popper.... your reply very detailed....POWER!

[kenl]

[QUOTE=Cheri_Popper]Firstly it is forgery with the intention to cheat. I doubt she will be charge for this as she is the victim in this case.

Secondly, she is an overstayer and her visa had expired and her status.....


Bro Cheri,

You then solid....such data also can find.......peifu........

[Cheri_Popper]

Bro CP,
if she is really charged under this act, any chance to find out where she is held and for how long before being send back to China?:confused:

She will probably be held in Changi Woman's Prison.

You can try to get more info from the Police Station where she was detained or ICA. You must have her real particulars.

Usually Illegal Immigrants are sentenced between 3-6 mths of imprisonments.

She should have told them about her "agent" so that she would be able to remain in SG for the investigation as well as the procecution of the "agent". She will be given a special pass by ICA.

[Cheri_Popper]

Bro Cheri,
You then solid....such data also can find.......peifu........
As long as you know abit of law and under what Act the offence is commited, you will able to find the necessary datas. ;)

[machoman]

As long as you know abit of law and under what Act the offence is commited, you will able to find the necessary datas. ;)

CP, really respect your deep knowledge of the law!:cool:

[Cheri_Popper]

CP, really respect your deep knowledge of the law!:cool:
There are many more other samsters like Wanderer23, SexLover, Hanxinco88, Otur, Big Sexy, Ro|f etc with much more knowledge of it than me. :)

[aikoN79]

.......... That means i can visit Na Na at CWP if she was caught in last nite raid ??? whoopie ~:p

[Cheri_Popper]

.......... That means i can visit Na Na at CWP if she was caught in last nite raid ??? whoopie ~:p
KNN! You are beyond hope liao! lolx! :D

[Hanxinco88]

CP, really respect your deep knowledge of the law!:cool:

Commissioner of Police in action of course power la!!!!!!!

[Hanxinco88]

Send a MM to airport when her extended visa expired, but she was arrested as the visa was forged. She was held at ica. She called me to say that she was being charged for 2 offences the next day => cheating and overstay for more than 50+ days as she had extended twice for a month each.



Bro any idea what visa she is holding? A social visit ot a business visa???
For your knowledge a social visit visa cannot be extended unless there is a very special reasons to do so such as sickness etc...thus if her social visit visa is extended, definetely the extension normally a stamp on the passport is fake.....no agents in Singapore could extend for her.

If her original visa is forged, she would not be able to enter Singapore in the first place.



Cheers

[Cheri_Popper]

Commissioner of Police in action of course power la!!!!!!!
CB! Afterwards my house kanna raid, I will put you as an Abettor hor! :p

[Cheri_Popper]

For your knowledge a social visit visa cannot be extended unless there is a very special reasons to do so such as sickness etc...thus if her social visit visa is extended, definetely the extension normally a stamp on the passport is fake.....no agents in Singapore could extend for her.


There are a couple of ways to extend her visa
1) Go for a short trip to nearby countries like Thailand and when she returns, she will likely to have her visa extended for a couple of days up to 14 days. She will need a valid air ticket to prove that she will leave SG on a certain date.
2) Go to ICA to extend her visa.
i) On Medication grounds -Proof that she is seeking medical attention in SG - Documentation proof from hospital
ii) On Student Pass ground - Apply for Student Pass and show proof of intending to seek Educational courses here. - Proof from School
iii) Application for extension of stay in SG - Give some good reasons - a valid air ticket back to her country is required

Cheers!

[Hanxinco88]

There are a couple of ways to extend her visa


Cheers!

Thanks Bro CP for the additional information and I would like to add on....
Going out of singapore and coming back is a common practise or I should say a more tediuos/risky practise as there are costs involved and the opportunity of not receiving the full extension as possession of a visa does not guarantee entry into Singapore and permission to entry is entirely discretionary at the point of entry. However proof of financial ability, holding cash of at least SGD$2000 will be an advantage.

As for applying in ICAS,
This will be subjected to the interviewer discretion thus for WL (gals), normally it is an immediate rejection as immigration officers always have reasons to believe that the case is not strong enough to substantiate their extended stay in Singapore.

Cheers

[Hanxinco88]

CB! Afterwards my house kanna raid, I will put you as an Abettor hor! :p

Abetting what har bro????

[singkumquat]

There are a couple of ways to extend her visa
1) Go for a short trip to nearby countries like Thailand and when she returns, she will likely to have her visa extended for a couple of days up to 14 days. She will need a valid air ticket to prove that she will leave SG on a certain date.
2) Go to ICA to extend her visa.
i) On Medication grounds -Proof that she is seeking medical attention in SG - Documentation proof from hospital
ii) On Student Pass ground - Apply for Student Pass and show proof of intending to seek Educational courses here. - Proof from School
iii) Application for extension of stay in SG - Give some good reasons - a valid air ticket back to her country is required

Cheers!

iv) Get hitch and go for ROM
v) Apply for Job depending on qualification one can apply for WP/SP/EP status

[six_2]

There are a couple of ways to extend her visa
1) Go for a short trip to nearby countries like Thailand and when she returns, she will likely to have her visa extended for a couple of days up to 14 days. She will need a valid air ticket to prove that she will leave SG on a certain date.
Cheers!

Bro C_P, how abt going to Batam ? Is there any problem to gain entry for PRC passport at the immigration in Batam, do they need visa as well ?
Tks & Regards..

[Cheri_Popper]

Bro C_P, how abt going to Batam ? Is there any problem to gain entry for PRC passport at the immigration in Batam, do they need visa as well ?
Tks & Regards..

Bro,
If I am not mistaken, most countries including Indo & Malaysia, they would need a visa.

I believed that Thailand and HK does not requrie visas.

Again, I might be wrong.

The best person to ask will be Bro Ro|fmaoxz

Cheers

[Hanxinco88]

bangkok is a preferred destination but unfortunately,ica has already profiled this place to be the "hot spot" for WLs.nw chances of going there and end up not able to enter singapore is very high.just some info that i like to share


Well done bro......

Cheers

[Rof|maoxz]

Bro,
If I am not mistaken, most countries including Indo & Malaysia, they would need a visa.

I believed that Thailand and HK does not requrie visas.

Again, I might be wrong.

The best person to ask will be Bro Ro|fmaoxz

Cheers

If pertaining to PRC visitors to thailand, They are given entry visas at the immigration checkpoints for the purpose of tourism for the period of not exceeding 15 days (Visa on arrival) Of course normal immigration rules applies:

1. The applicant must produce instrument of means of transport (full paid ticket) which is usable within 15 days since the date of entry.

2. They should bring a fair amount of currency for visits. (I do not know the rule of bring 20000BHT still applies or not)

3. Visitors who enter the Kingdom with Visa on Arrival generally cannot file an application for extension of stay except in special cases such as illness which prevents them from travelling, etc.


Generally PRC visitors have no problems in entering Hong Kong Special
Administrative Region. But rules still applies:

1. For entry into the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region, people from other parts of China must apply for approval. Among them, the number of persons who enter the Region for the purpose of settlement shall be determined by the competent authorities of the Central People's Government after consulting the government of the Region.

2. Mainland residents from Guangdong Province and seventeen cities, including Shanghai, Beijing, Nanjing, Suzhou, Wuxi, Hangzhou, Ningbo, Taizhou, Fuzhou, Xiamen, Quanzhou, Tianjin, Chongqing, Chengdu, Jinan, Shenyang and Dalian, who wish to come here for sightseeing purpose in individual capacity are required to obtain an Exit-entry Permit for travelling to and from Hong Kong and Macau and an "endorsement for individual visit (Fangwen)" valid for single or double-journey from the relevant Public Security Bureau Office.

[Cheri_Popper]

[QUOTE=kenl]


forgery of visa will kena charge as well,dosen't matter u use a forge visa and u r the victim coz it's the responsibility of the holder to ensure it's authenticity.overstaying will br charged and normally,less all the holidays and weekends,abt 1.5-2mths in prison.the prison is not changi prison but the one at portsdown road aka illegal immigrants prison.specifically used to house overstayers by the prison authorities.

Thanks for the clarification.

At the point of getting the Visa from the agent, the gal does not have any reasonable ground or doubt that the Visa obtained by the agent was forged. She had paid the agent to apply for her visa and had honestly believed that the visa obtain was real.

I believed that the AG Chambers would consider the facts before procceed to charge her for that particular offence.

I thought that Portsdown Prison only housed those male II and does not have the facilities to hold female prisoners.

[Cheri_Popper]

If pertaining to PRC visitors to thailand,

the ICA expert had spoken. All raise and salute the MAN! :p

Bro Rof|,
Thanks for the info.

[Malaysian Datuk]

One related question.....how come some overstayers are charge and some not charge? some are still given special passes and not even remanded and allowed to go home?

[Hanxinco88]

One related question.....how come some overstayers are charge and some not charge?

Bro..from what I know, it depends on the number of days overstayed...and of course whether first timer or not.....

Maybr Bro CP or Rof|maoxz would like to add....

Cheers

[Cheri_Popper]

One related question.....how come some overstayers are charge and some not charge? some are still given special passes and not even remanded and allowed to go home?

If I am not mistaken, these ppl had turned into Prosecution Witnesses against their Mafu or some other cases and are given a special pass until the case is over.

[Hanxinco88]

One Bro PM me asking the below mentioned question, can any experts help???


HaoDiDi
Samster (M) Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 4
My Reputation:Points: 10 / Power: 0


Thai Girl Entry to SG (Q & A)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi,

Nice thread bro..

When are you going to do Thai Girl Entry Q & A??


Do you know how long apart can they come to singapore each time?

One month?

Thanks and Merry Xmas..

[six_2]

indonesia can grant them landing visa at point of entry at a fee,nt sure how much.however,it's not avisable to try batam coz those dickheads at the customs in batam will keep finding ways to ask $ esp it's a prc.and if she is not granted entry to singapore after she return from batam,hell lot of problems eg,need to find her way to batam airport,book a flight go jakarta than got int'l flights.....not worth the hassle bro


just my two cents worth

Tks bros for the info. Really appreciate :p

[Rof|maoxz]

the ICA expert had spoken. All raise and salute the MAN! :p

Bro Rof|,
Thanks for the info.

From past experiences lah. Just to relate abit. All essential info are kept @ my special folder. :)

[Rof|maoxz]

One related question.....how come some overstayers are charge and some not charge? some are still given special passes and not even remanded and allowed to go home?

Hmm, quite an interesting Qs. In ICA's eye of view, Immigration offenders include Illegal Immigrants and Overstayers, where the former receives the more serious penalty. Additionally, it includes social visit pass (SVP) holders who worked illegally. :)

I do know that illegal entry and departure attracts penalties which are less severe than those for actual illegal entry and departure. While the penalty for illegal entry is a maximum 6 months' jail and mandatory caning of a minimum 3 strokes, the penalty for the attempted illegal entry offence is imprisonment of between 3 months to 2 years and a fine of $4,000, but no caning. For illegal departure, the penalty is a maximum $2,000 fine and 6 months' jail, while the penalty for attempted illegal departure is a maximum $2,000 fine and 3 months' jail. (Maybe CP can add on, I'm not pro in laws...)

Punishment aside, I have seen those holding LTSVP (Accompany child to govt/private school, in short Peidu MaMa pass) who was let off with a stern warning while being caught in KTV. So getting back to basic, it's case-by-case basis. Hence, holders of STSVP, Business pass, etc while getting caught in establishments, carry a lesser punishment then a overstayer (more heavy if he/she overstays at a long peroid of time). They will be investigated for immigration offences by the AV in a raid, who in turn, handover to ICA's hand. All this scenario depends on the I/O and the ICA officers carrying out their raid procedure.

On another note, those being released out of ICA building, means that their investigation has
been completed. The offender is allowed to purchase her own air-ticket to return back. Normally an ICA officer will see her off. Those overstayers normally won't get to let off so easily, arrangment will be made to escort them back to airport, and fly them back. Huang Na's mum also get this "special treatment".

[justme]

On another note, those being released out of ICA building, means that their investigation has
been completed. The offender is allowed to purchase her own air-ticket to return back. Normally an ICA officer will see her off. Those overstayers normally won't get to let off so easily, arrangment will be made to escort them back to airport, and fly them back. Huang Na's mum also get this "special treatment".

so overstayer uses taxpayer money to fly home? just thinking (me vry ignorant of law), if a WL overstay in singapore, get caught not in the act, then still get to fly home on our money ???

[Rof|maoxz]

On another note, those being released out of ICA building, means that their investigation has been completed. The offender is allowed to purchase her own air-ticket to return back. Normally an ICA officer will see her off. Those overstayers normally won't get to let off so easily, arrangment will be made to escort them back to airport, and fly them back. Huang Na's mum also get this "special treatment".

so overstayer uses taxpayer money to fly home? just thinking (me vry ignorant of law), if a WL overstay in singapore, get caught not in the act, then still get to fly home on our money ???

No no...she will fork out her own $$ to buy. If she do not have the means to purchase one, the authorities will help her seek chinese embassy for assistance. :)

[ManuelFerrara]

Sorry to dig out these old thread.

Some question i would like to ask the experts in this thread

One of my PRC GF was caught yesternite and currently in ICA. She is a 40+ days overstayer.

1.How long will she be kept at ICA? Can i visit her during the detain period?

2.Will she be charge in view of her overstaying period? If so, can i visit her at changi Woman prison.

3.Is there such a thing call "bail" her out?

Would appreciate that the experts here provide me an answer. Tks in advance.

[mebirdie]

1.How long will she be kept at ICA? Can i visit her during the detain period?

2.Will she be charge in view of her overstaying period? If so, can i visit her at changi Woman prison.

3.Is there such a thing call "bail" her out?

Would appreciate that the experts here provide me an answer. Tks in advance.

1. She will be kept in ICA till charged. No sure whether you can visit her. Do you want to visit her and may being questioned whether you have been harbouring her all the while.

2. She will charged of course. You can apply to visit her. Approval quite slim unless related.

3. She will be charged and sentence immediately. You can bail her if she pleaded not guilty or appeal. Thousands of $$$ will be in the drain.

[kenny_G]

I SALUTE you all brothers so deep knowledge of the Spore LAW.
But, do spare a thought for brothers who are not so knowledgeable.
Pls don't just cut and paste the facts for us to understand.
The language is so QUEEN's type and the sentence so long, it is very hard to understand. Can explain them in simple layman terms?
Thanks :D

[ShittyAss]

1.How long will she be kept at ICA? Can i visit her during the detain period?

Depends on how long they investigate..and very impt, where is she being caught? Dun think u can visit her during the detain period...Even if u request, u will have to know her true full details and have to describe your relationship with her...nt easy dude..

2.Will she be charge in view of her overstaying period? If so, can i visit her at changi Woman prison.

Yes for overstaying period....Case by case basis to visit her..and i think they can only make one phone call and one visit which is to settle all her stuff and the visit will be just before she flies back to mainland..

3.Is there such a thing call "bail" her out?

Dun think u are able to do tat...

Maybe snr bros can correct me if i am wrong..

Dude..dun think too much...i know the feeling is quite horrible..Have to move on... =)

[Uncle_Sam]

Brothers, you are absolutely correct!
Boy friends are not allowed to visit.
Only allowed 1 non related person to hand cash for the airfare back to her home country on the day of her departure.
Even sister also have difficulty visiting her.
Have to show Birth cert to prove relationship.
And only allowed to visit once.
Personal belongings even in a small bag also not allowed to be passed to her.
Very CHAMP you know!

[happywater]

So post this thread to ask bros here anyone encounter the same thing before for their MM? How long will she be jailed? Will she be able to come to Sg again?

Thanks in advance:)


I think very difficult for her to come in again liao... the ica will thumbprint her etc... or whatever they call it... if caught again using fake documents then lagi worse... all the best.

[Red_Tirak1099]

This is what I know from my experience....collected from 4 instances with PRC, Thais & Viet.

Usually straight forward case like overstay & if caught by AV is charged almost immediately, while waiting to be charge they are held in ICA basement. Cannot visit but your MM can request ICA to call you to inform you of court date & time. I managed to see mine briefly being transferred from ICA to court in van. Saw her in court too. Like I said very rushed so no time to think or engage lawyer. ICA gave me permission to pack her luggage to pass to her (but cannot visit). After sentence stay in Portsdown.....know her name & serial number can write to her & she can submit your name to request you & seek approval for visit but like once a week only. While visit can pass to her books & magazines too. Long hair all cut short very cham life inside. ICA also tell me pay for air-ticket for her.

Thats all I know, maybe some things change but my info is one year old

[ManuelFerrara]

Tks for the advise from all the bros here.

Juz thought of helping her as a fren. Nothing much. As i know, i am juz a ordinary person, not NEO from Matrix, can't save the world, so life goes on.

Currently, she is in ICA basement waiting to be sent back. However, her passport was lost while being despatch from police station to ICA so guess have to wait a while.

[Red_Tirak1099]

Currently, she is in ICA basement waiting to be sent back. However, her passport was lost while being despatch from police station to ICA so guess have to wait a while.
Getting send back is a better option instead of jail trust me. Remember she should NEVER never attempt to come back to SIN illegally. If caught again the consequences would be long jail term as they will slap her with many charges.

[ManuelFerrara]

Getting send back is a better option instead of jail trust me. Remember she should NEVER never attempt to come back to SIN illegally. If caught again the consequences would be long jail term as they will slap her with many charges.

Tks for the advise.

With the biometric system implemented by ICA and her thumprint+palm print being recorded, dun think she can ever dream of coming back liao.

[ken li]

Sorry to dig out these old thread.

Some question i would like to ask the experts in this thread
One of my PRC GF was caught yesternite and currently in ICA. She is a 40+ days overstayer.
1.How long will she be kept at ICA? Can i visit her during the detain period?
...Would appreciate that the experts here provide me an answer. Tks in advance.

Bro, most of your questions have been answered already... On detention before trial, they can hold her up to 48 hours, then they either have to bring her before a Magistrate (Judge) and charge her or they have to relase her on police bail. ICA will do all they can to charge her before 48 hours are up.

Visiting in remand? Probably not.

Yah... and hope she should not to try to sneak back in. Consequences are dire if caught.

Overstaying charge is not as serious as entry as illegal immigrant.

[beerrox]

I was told magazine sent in would be censored.
Pictures of men and women would be blackened with permanent ink.
Sexual words would also be blackened.
Some pages would also be torn off.
So what are left are probably senseless articles.
She can come to S’pore again after 1 year but with proper paper and must declare she ever overstayed and served sentence. Cannot lie.
Help, upp my miserable points pls!

[tmac]

She can come to S’pore again after 1 year but with proper paper and must declare she ever overstayed and served sentence. Cannot lie.
Help, upp my miserable points pls!

bro, if my fren is fr indonesia and she was jailed in sg, after she got out of jail, she able to cum in sg after 1 yr? :confused:

[ken li]

Tks for the advise.
With the biometric system implemented by ICA and her thumprint+palm print being recorded, dun think she can ever dream of coming back liao.

bro, if my fren is fr indonesia and she was jailed in sg, after she got out of jail, she able to cum in sg after 1 yr? :confused:

Hiaz... the way it works is like this... the department in charge is ICA (i.e. Immigration and Checkpoint Authority) also known as 'Immigration' (not to be confused with Customs and Excise Department).

Immigration has ABSOLUTE authority and discretion whether to grant visas, entry, employment passes, and PR status. They need not explain their decisions to anyone. So you will sometimes find seeming discrepancies in one foreigner being allowed in and another seemingly similar foreigner being barred.

For example, no one really can say with certainty whether an employment pass application or a PR application will be rejected or accepted. And upon rejection, there is usually no explanation given. I use this example because employment pass / PR application cases are known as the applicants are usually already in Singapore.

Cases of foreigners barred at checkpoints are hardly known to us singaporeans because we do not get a chance to meet these 'undesirable' foreigners. But just ask the WLs in KTVs who do multiple entries. They never know whether they will get granted for their 2nd and subsequent entries a 7 day extension or 21 days or one month until their passports are stamped. They are never told why.

Now, if you throw in a previous criminal conviction and sentence, what do you think are their chances? No brainer right?

I would say don't bother speculating. Chances are low of re-entry for people with convictions (except very minor stuff like traffic violations) and Immigration will never tell you the reason or the period of their ban.

[Red_Tirak1099]

Hiaz... the way it works is like this... the department in charge is ICA (i.e. Immigration and Checkpoint Authority) also known as 'Immigration' (not to be confused with Customs and Excise Department).

Immigration has ABSOLUTE authority and discretion whether to grant visas, entry, employment passes, and PR status. They need not explain their decisions to anyone. So you will sometimes find seeming discrepancies in one foreigner being allowed in and another seemingly similar foreigner being barred.


I got a real life case example of the 'solid' way the ICA operates....

My driver is married with a Thai, decent village girl who never came to Singapore b4....they have no kids. The wife was holding a LTSVP issued for 6 months. They applied for PR once but was rejected.
2 months ago when they went to ICA to renew the green card, ICA confiscated it & instead chop the wife's passport for 2 months validity & then gave them an 'approval' letter that allows for the wife to work in Singapore. They have not applied for the wife to work, no reasons were given by ICA for their actions. They were puzzled as to why ICA had 'encourage' the wife to find employment but put it down to my driver's low income & maybe ICA wanted the wife to be productive b4 their next PR application.
Due to the stringent conditions on the types of employment she can find & her inability to speak English & Mandrain, she was not able to get a job within 2 months. My driver went to ICA to appeal for an extension but was rejected on the spot & so the wife had to buy ticket & flew home hastily last week. They were told she is not to return in 3 months & even if after 3 months she might not be able to get a LTSVP or extension of visa. Again no explaination was given. Now my driver is lost & it is affecting his job, I would be inhuman to sack him but his lapses are costing me $$$.
So bottomline is for those marrying foreign wife take note if you are low imcome earner....the ICA will fuck you around big time. :mad:

[ken li]

I got a real life case example of the 'solid' way the ICA operates....
My driver is married with a Thai, decent village girl who never came to Singapore b4....they have no kids.
They applied for PR once but was rejected.
2 months ago when they went to ICA to renew the green card, ICA confiscated it & instead chop the wife's passport for 2 months validity ...
They were puzzled as to why ICA had 'encourage' the wife to find employment but put it down to my driver's low income & maybe ICA wanted the wife to be productive b4 their next PR application.
Again no explaination was given.
So bottomline is for those marrying foreign wife take note if you are low imcome earner....the ICA will fuck you around big time. :mad:

The above is typical.

Usually before PR applications, it is common for foreigners to apply for a work permits (WP) OR an Employment Pass (EP). WP holders can more or less forget about a PR application. WP holders are those who earn the lowest and they are not allowed to marry, get pregnant, etc etc here.

EP holders have a chance for PR as they are usually holding better jobs compared with WP holders. However, even among the EP holders there are different classes. Go ask around... you will find EP passes that are clearly classified differently. The top tier EP holders can (and are actually encouraged to) apply for PR. These are top execs earning top dollar. This is what the authorities truly want as "Foreign Talent". Lower tier EP holders... well good luck to you.

As a rough guide, a foreigner who is after PR on his/her own merit (i.e. not due to spousal relationship) should have:-
1. Qualifications that the country wants (This is not totally a Singapore concept. Australian immigration has adopted this approach as well).
2. A good stable job that pays well, e.g. a bank analyst.
OR
3. Be immensely rich (e.g. PRC tycoon). There are avenues to apply for and fast track PR applications if you have a few million dollars (SGD) to put in a Singapore private bank account.

If you do marry a foreigner, you should have a good job that pays well enough so that ICA will not have any reason to suspect that your spouse will not be looked after and will end up a welfare case. It is not very kind but it is practical, much like everything else in this country.

And yes... Red_Tirak... your example is very common... and just to make it clear, the woman does not have to be Thai. I have heard of a guy who married a Jap lady. On account of his job and qualifications, she had a really hard time. To complicate matters, they married while she was on an EP (lower scale) which was promptly revoked. So your driver may have to prepare for regular visits to Thailand.