My Fillial Daughter

[farark]

Conclusion

It is not my intention to criticize bro SC, I am looking at this from a macro perspective here. Unfortunately, the problem is seen by us in bewilderment because in Singapore, we are too used to our middle income/middle class status to fully make sense of what we deem to be obscene abuse by the family on the WLS.

All I can say that what we witness here is the viciousness of what poverty does to people and their psyche. Remember, these people are living from hand to mouth since they can remember. I may sound like I pity them and feel they are right, but on the contrary, I just hope that I have been as neutral as I set out to be.

So what can we do and what are the implications?

1. Fuck it and move on. As heartless as this may sound, in the first place, it is known that except for very rare circumstances, relationships with WLs are gonna be tough… Having a family to worry about will worsen the situation.

2. Convince the WL to run away from it all and live happily ever after. If you can then good for you, but sooner or later, she will miss her family so much that she will go back to them. If you prevent the inevitable, you’re simply planting resentment into your relationship with her.

3. Read up on Thaksinomics and help them to get out of poverty(?) What’s that? The only way out of this trap is to get in control and try to snap the family out of poverty and work with them to make them self sufficient. That way, they will make better persons of themselves. The most noble thing to do, but guess what?

They’ll hate you for it in the short term because the family is suddenly being run by some young punk know-it-all foreigner who is telling their daughter what they can or can’t do. But if the family is conducive to your control and you’re good at Thaksinomics, hey, who knows, you may get them out of poverty and make them self-sufficient. Noble as it is, tough… Look at Thaksin’s financial aids to the rural North, some families succeeded, but that is a small minority compared to the large numbers of pickup trucks and motorcycles bought with the government handout.

Just my 2 satang’s worth.

Originally Posted by thaivisitor

The family's thinking is very simple. Since she was able to earn so much within 2 years, surely she can do the same again.

Do u know what's the real reason?
Not to say i'm religious or what but it's got to do with 'karma'.
The way they earn this money is due to doing a bad 'karma' so the money will not 'stay' with them for long.

In layman terms, it's easy come easy go.

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by farark

Several answers to that… In countries with large income disparities between the rural villages … Therefore the rural family’s annual contribution to the economy is 13% of that of the urban fresh graduate.
Look at the same comparison in Singapore, say a factory worker in Singapore with an income of $800 per month and a fresh graduate with $1,800 per month. The percentage of contribution to the economy by the former vs. the latter is 44%.
The above two statistics tell you that as a more developed economy, our income disparity is less apparent as that of the Thai rural North vs. urban centre.
Coupled with a high level of illiteracy, these girls have very little chance of getting a job other than working as WLs. … they would (highly unlikely) send back ฿2,500 per month…
Of course those who are able (due to looks) stand a chance to go into the flesh trade where incomes of ฿50,000 are not impossible.
………
However, there’s almost always an underlying goal for all WLs – to be the next Julia Roberts ala Pretty Woman and hook a rich man who will take them out of the misery of providing sex for cash.

Great views on the statistics, figures are around there more or less.
Every WL hopes that the guy they love will be RICH, but often than not the ones they love are not RICH. And sometimes really if no choice, they will choose the RICH rather than the LOVE.

Originally Posted by farark

In this instance, I assume you’re talking about the Northern/Northeastern rural regions.

I am talking about it in a general term. It includes the SOUTHERN part as well.

Originally Posted by farark

The family is usually bigger than that of the urban centres. Being less literate than the urban centres, … The reason for this is because it is believed that the lands there are less fertile than those in the South.

….. Where there is a family member who is able (because of minimal schooling, looks, etc.), money would be saved (or borrowed) to send her to work in the urban centres where the income levels are higher.

The said family member, thus becomes the breadwinner of the family.…..Got to do with some Buddhist thingy or something.

Another great insight.

Originally Posted by farark

Contrary to what many WLs would lead us to believe, the families by and large know that their daughters are participating in the flesh trade. They just erase it from their consiousness.

Consciousness can be erased, but it can never erase the TRUTH.

Originally Posted by farark

Like a large proportion of minority people living below the poverty line, there is very little idea to the value of money… Having being used to living hand to mouth, the concept of savings elude them, many a times, the money will be spent on alcohol/substance abuse and/or other frivolous items.

Why? Simple, they think that such spendings should be done now, than later as they had suffered throughout the years. They have already spent many years etching out a living, it’s time to enjoy themselves.

….In the Singaporean context, if your parents racked up huge amounts of gambling debts, it is not necessary to go into the flesh trade to repay the debts. Why? Because the laws in Singapore allows people to seek the protection of the courts and declare bankruptcy.
Now, if you were a daughter who through no fault of yours, look slightly presentable and able to make the money as a WL to pay off the debt. Under the second circumstance, would you just say fuck it and let them die (in case you’re there as well, maybe you also die)?

It’s time for Singapore Bashers to be Silenced. We do have bankruptcy laws to protect us(Jokes aside)
You are the man to give insight again and again. All the years of experience with Thai Girls gives you the wealth of experience.
In my opinion, there is nothing wrong to pay off the debt by going into the FLESH trade. Because that’s a last resort. However, when the debt is paid up, I supposed that’s the end of the story. Most often than not, new debts resurface. We are not going to touch on how these debts come about.
Helping Once, Helping Twice, Helping Thrice?????………..

Originally Posted by farark

Parents who continue to chalk up more debts gambling? Some points to note. In many cases, gambling to the poor is an avenue to make it big… To get out of poverty. You may say it’s bullshit, but hey, we’re looking at it from the point of view of the middle-class, not the illiterate and unwashed…
…Gambling is their only chance (albeit a mirage) of making it big

…………….Now, if after one year of receiving ฿30,000 per month and the money stops coming, what happens? Simple, they’ll all die… Because they have probably spent ฿50,000 per month thinking that the arrears could be settled the following month.

Sad to say, most of us here bet or gamble to a certain extent. But good to say is most of us here BET WITHIN OUR MEANS. With a huge windfall, it can make or break a person. Making him to be successful with the cash on hand, or making him fall further into the demise of more gambling and more debts

Anyone can distribute as much wealth as possible to their loved ones, but the loved ones must know how to use it wisely. When big money is seen, the motivation to move up in life suddenly disappears.

If they have no money, they will not simply die. They adopt the works of Shakespeare
“Money is meant to be spent and spent. Once all is spent, more money has to be found to spend further”

Its "found" not "earned".

Originally Posted by farark

1. Fuck it and move on. As heartless as this may sound, in the first place, it is known that except for very rare circumstances, relationships with WLs are gonna be tough… Having a family to worry about will worsen the situation.

2. Convince the WL to run away from it all and live happily ever after. If you can then good for you, but sooner or later, she will miss her family so much that she will go back to them. If you prevent the inevitable, you’re simply planting resentment into your relationship with her.

3. Read up on Thaksinomics and help them to get out of poverty(?) What’s that? The only way out of this trap is to get in control and try to snap the family out of poverty and work with them to make them self sufficient. That way, they will make better persons of themselves. The most noble thing to do, but guess what?

They’ll hate you for it in the short term because the family is suddenly being run by some young punk know-it-all foreigner who is telling their daughter what they can or can’t do. But if the family is conducive to your control and you’re good at Thaksinomics, hey, who knows, you may get them out of poverty and make them self-sufficient. Noble as it is, tough… Look at Thaksin’s financial aids to the rural North, some families succeeded, but that is a small minority compared to the large numbers of pickup trucks and motorcycles bought with the government handout.

1.Relationship with a WL is tough. Relationship with a WL with a big family is tougher. Relationship with a WL with a big and poor family is the toughest.
Doesn’t it occur to anyone that those who fall in love with WLs with a small family (when I mean small, it means probably left only 1 sibling), the going is very much easier.

2.Never break up the FAMILY. Never badmouth the FAMILY in front of her. NEVER.

3.This 3rd point is worth lots of money. 2 million baht also not enough. Kekeke. Use your advantage as a foreigner. Give them DREAMS, give them HOPE. For that you will constantly need to MOTIVATE the FAMILY.

4……………SHORT & SIMPLE PLAN, not advisable to share in FORUM.

Wah, finally finished answering your whole posting.

Hahaha
SC

[tirak69]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

when the debt is paid up, I supposed that’s the end of the story. Most often than not, new debts resurface. We are not going to touch on how these debts come about.
Helping Once, Helping Twice, Helping Thrice?????………..

Sad to say, most of us here bet or gamble to a certain extent. But good to say is most of us here BET WITHIN OUR MEANS. With a huge windfall, it can make or break a person. Making him to be successful with the cash on hand, or making him fall further into the demise of more gambling and more debts

Anyone can distribute as much wealth as possible to their loved ones, but the loved ones must know how to use it wisely. When big money is seen, the motivation to move up in life suddenly disappears.

If they have no money, they will not simply die. They adopt the works of Shakespeare
“Money is meant to be spent and spent. Once all is spent, more money has to be found to spend further”
SC

to the poor, the dream never ends until they hit the "BIG " one. else it will always be the dream and they will be forever pursuing it. you have to remember they live at subsistence level and winning the lottey gives them the hope to go on with that job that pay 1000THB a month. its not by choice, its the environment that they grew up in. to them they never had the opportunity to think of future cos its so bleak... so everyday is drink and be merry for they do not know what tomorrow will be. thus the help will never end and its a vicious cycle.

i am not say they are rite or wrong... its the environment and we just have to accept the fact that they are living in a different world. we have to either accept the fact or accept the fact that loving a WL has only 1% chance of succeeding and making it to "pretty women" stage.

my 2 satangs worth.

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by tirak69

i am not say they are rite or wrong... its the environment and we just have to accept the fact that they are living in a different world. we have to either accept the fact or accept the fact that loving a WL has only 1% chance of succeeding and making it to "pretty women" stage.

my 2 satangs worth.

Correction though. it should be 0.01%. kekeke

To love a WL, you have to love all her problems.

SC

[farark]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

It’s time for Singapore Bashers to be Silenced. We do have bankruptcy laws to protect us(Jokes aside)
You are the man to give insight again and again. All the years of experience with Thai Girls gives you the wealth of experience.
In my opinion, there is nothing wrong to pay off the debt by going into the FLESH trade. Because that’s a last resort. However, when the debt is paid up, I supposed that’s the end of the story. Most often than not, new debts resurface. We are not going to touch on how these debts come about.
Helping Once, Helping Twice, Helping Thrice?????………..

Thanks for the compliment. These insights may have little to do with "years of experience with Thai Girls", more so, I was unlucky (or some say lucky) enough to have gone through quite a few knocks here and there.

On the issue of when to stop helping... I have a personal experience to share. Many years ago when I was based in Australia, I came back for a holiday and met a girl (Singaporean). We fell in love very quickly and after a year of long distance relationship, I proposed. I even got my parents blessings to get help her over to Australia with PR status. She was excited, but alas, rejected me. Why?

She came from a poor family (by Singapore's standards) with four other siblings, 2 brothers and two sisters and all older than her. The two brothers were hardly able to maintain themselves (the eldest one was more interested in being a monk while the second one was believed to be always in debt because of gambling) let alone the parents. The two older sisters were married to blue collar workers and their combined incomes were barely enough to sustain the 2 kids they each had.

That left her with the burden of providing for her parents the father was a retired vegetables seller, aged 70 in 1992 then doing nothing but gambling; mother was a housewife in her late 60s.

As unfair as it sounded, we never came to being because unfortunately, she felt it her duty to ensure that her parents were cared for. This was done out of her perceived duty to her parents. I was 22 then and she was 21. She had previously sacrificed her future when at 20 she opted out of NUS not because she couldn't afford it (through study loans), but rather, it would be a burden to the family for her to be unemployed.

I had offered her an alternative lifestyle, one where she could gain an education and be with the guy she loved, but she rejected it (in tears and hysteria) because of her perceived duty to her parents. She earned $1,300 then and I believed that she had only about $600 spending money/savings and the rest, to the parents (and probably siphoned to the sons).

This is perhaps a good example of the Asian mentality of duty to the family.

Originally Posted by siamcutey

1.Relationship with a WL is tough. Relationship with a WL with a big family is tougher. Relationship with a WL with a big and poor family is the toughest.
Doesn’t it occur to anyone that those who fall in love with WLs with a small family (when I mean small, it means probably left only 1 sibling), the going is very much easier.

2.Never break up the FAMILY. Never badmouth the FAMILY in front of her. NEVER.

3.This 3rd point is worth lots of money. 2 million baht also not enough. Kekeke. Use your advantage as a foreigner. Give them DREAMS, give them HOPE. For that you will constantly need to MOTIVATE the FAMILY.

4……………SHORT & SIMPLE PLAN, not advisable to share in FORUM.

Totally agree with your assessment on my three proposals... I believe you saw the fact that they were made with a particular leaning towards option 1. Why? Simple, you hurt yourself, but it won't take long to heal the wound (unless one is totally fucked up by the gongtao set upon him, but then again, if kena gongtao, won't bitch about the family's demands on them).

Now with regards about option 4, need to discuss it over a round of drinks.

Just my 2 satang's worth...

Cheers!

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by farark

1. Why? Simple, you hurt yourself, but it won't take long to heal the wound (unless one is totally fucked up by the gongtao set upon him, but then again, if kena gongtao, won't bitch about the family's demands on them).

Now with regards about option 4, need to discuss it over a round of drinks.

Giving in to the demands of the FAMILY, I believed only solve the problem temporarily. When the month end comes, you still have to give. LOVE is BLIND. And many a times, it makes the man unable to see these problems that are waiting for him. Mutual Love will never be able to sustain the relationship alone. Bread will. The more the easier. One must be sober when dealing with this problems.

Sometimes on the surface, doesn't it look better that the girl is cheating on the guy instead? At least the guy can make 1 clean break. Rather than knowing the girl whom he loved is actually working hard trying to provide for the FAMILY.

As for option 4, need to be real JAI DUM to accomplish it.

Thinking back now and then even after 10-20 years, one will surely feel a tinge of sadness. Don't you think so even after relating your story.

Like said earlier, this thread is just an info thread for people to read and understand that how fortunate we are many a times.

SC

[liketoplay]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

As for option 4, need to be real JAI DUM to accomplish it.

Thinking back now and then even after 10-20 years, one will surely feel a tinge of sadness. Don't you think so even after relating your story.

Like said earlier, this thread is just an info thread for people to read and understand that how fortunate we are many a times.

SC

I think I know your option 4 ... Needs Jai Dum and lots of courage.
Relationship with WL is definitely not easy .
If thier mentality towards providing for the family don't change , its almost impossible to maintain the relationship cos no matter how much you can provide its still not enough.

[Sinoview]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

In my opinion, thai girls are very fillial.

They can forgo their dignity, their body, their youth, earn as much money as possible, give their parents. Stupid or Fillial, I can't answer though.

When they reach marriageable age, they forgo marriage, they can forgo those who love them, to earn as much money as possible for their parents. Stupid or Fillial, I can't answer again.

When they decide to "hang up their career", they have crossed their expiry date. They will stay with their parents and take care of them till the parents pass away. How about having a family? They don't think of that. The answer they give you
"My sister and brother have families themselves and they will carry the family line. They have their own families and I being the odd one out will be the one to take care of my Parents."

Stupid or Fillial, I can answer. Fillial to the extend of being stupid.

Hold back your hankies, never shed a single tear over it. Because it happens everywhere especially in povern stricken countries.

SC

You're certainly spot on here. In China, many WLs too acted likewise. So i really doubt if "the family" factor is confined only to the "thai culture".

Very often, in China we can hear these WLs claimed that their parents din't love them and often asked and concerned about the "money" they will sent home than their livelihood. Yet at the end of the day, they will "work" their shit out to sent money home for various reasons.

It's also very common in China not only for these WLs to sent their hard earned money for their parents but also to assist their sibbings like a loan to a brother for a "van" to start a small transport business, a loan to a sister
to start a shop etc... And many a times, the business will failed and there goes their loans.....

From my experiences in China, the WLs here have that similar "family" bagauge with them.

Like you said, I think it happens everywhere especially in povern stricken countries..... Call it "proverty symdromme" ???

[farark]

Originally Posted by Sinoview

You're certainly spot on here. In China, many WLs too acted likewise. So i really doubt if "the family" factor is confined only to the "thai culture".

Very often, in China we can hear these WLs claimed that their parents din't love them and often asked and concerned about the "money" they will sent home than their livelihood. Yet at the end of the day, they will "work" their shit out to sent money home for various reasons...

... From my experiences in China, the WLs here have that similar "family" bagauge with them.

Like you said, I think it happens everywhere especially in povern stricken countries..... Call it "proverty symdromme" ???

The problem is not merely due to the poverty, family, but most importantly it can also be attributed to Asian culture of family values, filial piety, provision of alms for good karma (hope you get my point here).

This does not even limit itself to WLs. Remember the Samsui women and a more apparent one, the Ma jie (Cantonese) who swear a life of celibacy and work for the rich as servants.

In olden days, it was not surprising to find one female sibling (usually unmarried) who will not marry off but rather stay behind to look after the elderly parents.

[Sinoview]

Originally Posted by farark

The problem is not merely due to the poverty, family, but most importantly it can also be attributed to Asian culture of family values, filial piety, provision of alms for good karma (hope you get my point here).

This does not even limit itself to WLs. Remember the Samsui women and a more apparent one, the Ma jie (Cantonese) who swear a life of celibacy and work for the rich as servants.

In olden days, it was not surprising to find one female sibling (usually unmarried) who will not marry off but rather stay behind to look after the elderly parents.

Ha..ha.. Looks like in yr opinion the "family" factor is a compliment for them. They seem like "heros" who scracrificed themselves for the family...

I dont think our thread starter bro SC will agreed to that....

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by Sinoview

Ha..ha.. Looks like in yr opinion the "family" factor is a compliment for them. They seem like "heros" who scracrificed themselves for the family...

I dont think our thread starter bro SC will agreed to that....

Taking care of the family is what everyone should do.
But in some cases, some "FAMILIES" don't deserve the good karma that falls upon them.

SC

[Sornporn]

Kudos to bro farark.

My opinion somewhat same as you, but could not be expressed the way you did.

Easy to dump the 'useless' family, but not easy to do it when the Asian Values are entrenched in us. Somehow and somewhere we may feel 'guilty' in our heart. What my sec teacher told me...Just imagine what you can do to your family now, your kids can do to you in the future.

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by Sornporn

Just imagine what you can do to your family now, your kids can do to you in the future.

Just imagine what you caused your child to be into, and one day your grandchildren will do that back to your child.

Not talking about the problem, doesn't mean the problem is not around. Its just that there is no solution to the problem.

SC

[Sornporn]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

Just imagine what you caused your child to be into, and one day your grandchildren will do that back to your child.

Not talking about the problem, doesn't mean the problem is not around. Its just that there is no solution to the problem.

SC

I don't get you???